WHO IS STAYING? (ANSWER: Green, Richards, Washington, Baker)

[40bill]

Sounds like a few people might be better off taking a break from UK basketball till Cal is gone.

I don't know that it will make any difference. I checked the NBA salary board and, to be honest, this greying head is astounded at the amount of money we are speaking of.
when you are speaking of the lower one hundred players in hundreds of thousands of dollars per season, it brings home again the desire of these young folks to leave an institution that IN THEORY doesn't allow them to make enough to have pizza parties.

I think I saw that Darius Miller, bless his heart, is something like the 130 th player at his position...at over a million and a half dollars per season.

The per capita income in Kentucky is around 48,000 a year. Darius at number 130 makes over thirty years of average income. THIS year alone.

How can anyone reasonably ask these kids (and let's face it, most don't have the blessing of having a family with strong income) to NOT go for this brass ring when each trip up and down the court could be a blown out knee or ankle??????

[George]

Sounds like a few people might be better off taking a break from UK basketball till Cal is gone.

Why?

[Joneslab]

I posted a few years ago that WCN, of all the message boards I can think of, was harsher on Cal than any other place.

A Kentucky sportswriter sent me an e-mail late Christmas Eve that year to basically scoff at that idea. He basically called the point idiotic.

I stand by it though.

Couple reasons.

One, some folks on here didn't want Cal to begin with. And two, our posters skew toward the older and more "traditional." So it makes sense.

BUT I will say that we're entering into kind of a different time. We can all only speak for ourselves personally, but my own take is that I don't care if any of them go pro...as long as Kentucky really does succeed. If you go to the Final Four, or even the Elite Eight, and you lose players, then fine. You can't ask for much more than that. You're in the mix for a national title, and if you start running out coaches for that then we all probably need another hobby.

But if you've got an 11-loss Sweet Sixteen team who spent a good deal of the season looking awful? That's a totally different story. That's when one-and-done goes ****************eyed. You start to string seasons together where we don't get to a Final Four then I start to wonder if one-and-dones are worth it and if there's a better way.

For Cal's first few seasons, even with the NIT year, I was pretty convinced that the experiment was right. Now that the recruiting has slipped and we've started to see the warts, I'm not so sure.

[George]

I posted a few years ago that WCN, of all the message boards I can think of, was harsher on Cal than any other place.

A Kentucky sportswriter sent me an e-mail late Christmas Eve that year to basically scoff at that idea. He basically called the point idiotic.

I stand by it though.

Couple reasons.

One, some folks on here didn't want Cal to begin with. And two, our posters skew toward the older and more "traditional." So it makes sense.

BUT I will say that we're entering into kind of a different time. We can all only speak for ourselves personally, but my own take is that I don't care if any of them go pro...as long as Kentucky really does succeed. If you go to the Final Four, or even the Elite Eight, and you lose players, then fine. You can't ask for much more than that. You're in the mix for a national title, and if you start running out coaches for that then we all probably need another hobby.

But if you've got an 11-loss Sweet Sixteen team who spent a good deal of the season looking awful? That's a totally different story. That's when one-and-done goes ****************eyed. You start to string seasons together where we don't get to a Final Four then I start to wonder if one-and-dones are worth it and if there's a better way.

For Cal's first few seasons, even with the NIT year, I was pretty convinced that the experiment was right. Now that the recruiting has slipped and we've started to see the warts, I'm not so sure.

I made this very point as the team began to heat up around the SEC tourney. If we look bad-to-mediocre for most of the season, then heat up just enough to earn our players some draft attention, they'd better get out there and win it all. Otherwise, to me Sweet Sixteens and Elite Eights just aren't worth losing half our team.

[Joneslab]

I made this very point as the team began to heat up around the SEC tourney. If we look bad-to-mediocre for most of the season, then heat up just enough to earn our players some draft attention, they'd better get out there and win it all. Otherwise, to me Sweet Sixteens and Elite Eights just aren't worth losing half our team.

Think there's a big difference in an Elite Eight and a Sweet Sixteen, particularly if you lose like we did to North Carolina.

If you lose on a last-second shot, then what the hell can you do as a coach? Now if it keeps happening again and again and again in the E8, then that's one thing. But you win 30+ games and lose in the Elite Eight? If you blast that as a fan then you're a hopeless cause.

The Sweet Sixteen is different. Especially when you lose 11 games. Especially when you lose to a garbage team like we just lost to.

This past season was not very good. 2017 was an excellent season. I don't care what anybody says. That was a really good team that pretty much maxed out.

The problem is that we haven't been in the mix for two of the last three years. That's not good enough and I would expect Cal to feel the same way.

The only way to fix it is to land elite players or get guys back. It doesn't look like we're doing either*.

* I do think Keldon Johnson is an elite player. Not sure about the others.

[George]

The only way to fix it is to land elite players or get guys back. It doesn't look like we're doing either*.

Maybe the most troubling development of the last year is that Cal let it be known that he was going to try to bring Knox back in the fold, then immediately failed. If he can't talk some of these fringe guys into coming back, all the while losing out on the best incoming players, then the naysayers are probably right and the likelihood of winning another championship with Cal is slim.

Cal's had a pretty bad year going all the way back to the U19. Bad enough that when viewed on the whole, you have to wonder if something's going on.

[Joneslab]

I agree with that point but I'm not sure Knox is really a fringe guy. Fringe to me is a player more like a Vanderbilt or a Dakari or Teague or somebody like that.

I do agree with what you're saying though and I had the same thought when I heard the Knox news. When Cal starts failing to talk guys into coming back AND he starts failing to bring in the Zions of the world is when things could get really Tubby-like round here.

Note however that I still hold out hope Kentucky can be very good next year. We can't lose any more than Shai and Hami though, and we've got to have some good fortune in terms of player improvement. If we don't get Montgomery (or even if get Montgomery and he's on the slow track) then Nick Richards is essentially going to have to be a different human being for us to be a legit title contender

[Chaz]

I don't mind the OAD and like winning. However, I believe Cal got greedy after a couple of years
by wanting all of the top talent, who wouldn't you say. I could see it happening with Poy and Miller
leaving only Willis and Hawkins as upperclassmen. We've had very little experience in the
upper grades. We need some veteran leadership. We need 1-2 players a year who will be 2-3 year
players at least who can contribute. I would like to see Cal adjust to play developing players more
and not leave all of the favored ones in making mistake after mistake. Many times the bench is
a great teacher.

[J.Jennings]

If you are thinking about coming back but Cal rips up your scholarship, what are you supposed to do? Just ask Bam and Monk and who knows how many others

[Lighthouse]

If you are thinking about coming back but Cal rips up your scholarship, what are you supposed to do? Just ask Bam and Monk and who knows how many others

Explain please.

[George]

Explain please.

Recent story on KSR detailed conversations that Bam and Monk had with Cal, during which Cal ceremoniously "ripped up" their scholarships. He's rumored to have done this with other players, as well, indicating that the player has no say in whether or not he comes back for an additional year.

[George]

I agree with that point but I'm not sure Knox is really a fringe guy. Fringe to me is a player more like a Vanderbilt or a Dakari or Teague or somebody like that.

"Fringe" as in edge of the lottery. I'd be willing to bet that he'll fall a few spots below his predicted range.

[catfaninin]

Think there's a big difference in an Elite Eight and a Sweet Sixteen, particularly if you lose like we did to North Carolina.

If you lose on a last-second shot, then what the hell can you do as a coach? Now if it keeps happening again and again and again in the E8, then that's one thing. But you win 30+ games and lose in the Elite Eight? If you blast that as a fan then you're a hopeless cause.

The Sweet Sixteen is different. Especially when you lose 11 games. Especially when you lose to a garbage team like we just lost to.

This past season was not very good. 2017 was an excellent season. I don't care what anybody says. That was a really good team that pretty much maxed out.

The problem is that we haven't been in the mix for two of the last three years. That's not good enough and I would expect Cal to feel the same way.

The only way to fix it is to land elite players or get guys back. It doesn't look like we're doing either*.

* I do think Keldon Johnson is an elite player. Not sure about the others.

He probably isn't considered elite but Tyler Herro has looked really good this weekend. Lot's of talk about how underrated he is.

[KevinHall]

Recent story on KSR detailed conversations that Bam and Monk had with Cal, during which Cal ceremoniously "ripped up" their scholarships. He's rumored to have done this with other players, as well, indicating that the player has no say in whether or not he comes back for an additional year.

If that's true and I don't doubt you, then that is just a totally stupid thing Cal did. You just don't run off good players if they really want to stay. Just asinine.

[George]

If that's true and I don't doubt you, then that is just a totally stupid thing Cal did. You just don't run off good players if they really want to stay. Just asinine.

He’s done this going back to his Memphis days.