Kentucky vs. Missouri: Game Thread

[Joneslab]

Unless Cal is planning to leave or something after this year. Then all bets are off.

There's a reason this team is struggling and inconsistent: it doesn't have the very kinds of top-shelf talent you have to have to see a lot of guys leave for the League.

People say "The NBA drafts on potential..." The problem is with a lot of these guys the pro potential just isn't there. This is a team that can have some really good college players. But I think only three, maybe four of these guys will ever play in the NBA.

[GOCAT15]

And what a true disappointment Hami has been. It’s almost comical he was almost drafted in the first round. Other than being able to jump through the roof he does nothing.

[BobS]

Cal will never talk anyone into coming back. I can’t believe any fan would even think that is possible. Goes against his mantra.

Cal whiffed in his main targets 2 years in a row. His biggest recruiting effort will be praying the NBA ignores his own players.

[KevinHall]

The bricklayers of America would have been proud of this game. But no one else can be. I know at one time in my life I was a better shooter than just about everyone on this team. For the life of me I don't know why Cal would not recruit a couple of good knock down shooters. The only reason I know is not many of them are five star players. Sometimes you have get someone who does the very basic of basketball,which is shooting, no matter what they are rated by some so called recruiting expert. Two made three pointers are not going to win you many games in college basketball today. Six is the minimun most nights. Six tonight would have been a W.
Diallo may be a fine athlete but he is no basketball player. He has no smarts for the game and can do none of the fundamentals that would satisfy a grade school coach. I really can't see him playing in the G league much less the NBA. Maybe he can make it in the Upper Siberian League?
Missouri isn't a very good team either. This was UK's best chance at getting a road win for the rest of the season. UK had better beat Tennessee Tuesday at home because there's a snowball's chance in Hades that they are winning the next two after that at A&M and Auburn.
This is what you can expect from an all freshmen team. No consistency and bad performances on a fairly regular basis. Every now then they will throw us bone like the WVU and UL games. But otherwise this is what we will get the rest of the season.

[Lighthouse]

It was obvious Mizzou had prepared for Shai's drive and for the most part kept him out of it. This was another ugly game and very physical. Teams are going to play us that way because it works. Sometimes we can pull it out, but we better be ready because we can expect games like this the rest of the way.

I agree with Kevin. Diallo is an athlete who isn't good at the game he's selected to play. Maybe an NFL team would be interested in his speed.

[Westtncat]

Does anyone else ever get the feeling that Cal would never bench a "prospect" for fear of losing a recruit yet to be? I have had this feeling several times throughout his career. I know personally, I would not let someone continually make bad choices and leave them in. Some turnovers, missed shots, or other mistakes are acceptable. Not passing over and over. Cant let that go on.

[Jload]

I don’t care what these kids do after the season. That’s pretty much our main topic as UK fans now who’s going pro.It SHOULD be why are we playing so poorly. Why do we shoot so poorly. Why do we play such shoddy defense. Why is our energy level on the court so low. What is each member of our squad doing or NOT doing to make Kentucky a better basketball team. Instead everyone obsesses about who’s going and who isn’t constantly. I am sick of Cals system, can’t wait for him to retire or move on.

[Joneslab]

Cal will never talk anyone into coming back. I can’t believe any fan would even think that is possible. Goes against his mantra.

Cal whiffed in his main targets 2 years in a row. His biggest recruiting effort will be praying the NBA ignores his own players.

Talked Terrence Jones into coming back. I think he talked Patrick Patterson into coming back in some ways.

The idea that he pushes them out makes no sense with players like are on this team. I have to believe that doesn't happen with kids who are borderline--and all these players are. The reason we can say that with some confidence is that if you look at Cal's freshmen, those who have left have all been on draft boards. We haven't had Nick Richards type decisions made by freshmen. Even Orton and Archie Goodwin were projected near the first round. You don't have players just making wild leaps. That's not how it has worked in the past.

I doubt if he'll be super aggressive; if a kid wants to leave the program, then that means his family wants him to leave. That's too much for a coach to push against.

But Cal wants to win college basketball games. In the past he's used recruiting to do that, but now the recruiting has run out. Everything has changed. Everything. I don't believe he'll sabotage himself or the program by allowing players to make cataclysmically weird decisions like Nick Richards of all people trying to play professional basketball.

I think fans assume players like this are just like DeMarcus Cousins and are handled the same way. That's just not happening.

[Joneslab]

I don’t care what these kids do after the season. That’s pretty much our main topic as UK fans now who’s going pro.It SHOULD be why are we playing so poorly. Why do we shoot so poorly. Why do we play such shoddy defense. Why is our energy level on the court so low. What is each member of our squad doing or NOT doing to make Kentucky a better basketball team. Instead everyone obsesses about who’s going and who isn’t constantly. I am sick of Cals system, can’t wait for him to retire or move on.

I get this, but as long as that one-and-done rule is there it doesn't matter who the coach is--we're going to be talking about this stuff after the season.

Obviously we wouldn't be talking about it with the same fervor we do now, but it would still happen. Unless you're not recruiting the players you should be at a place like Kentucky, all these programs have to worry about players leaving.

Cal could leave tomorrow and these conversations would continue to happen.

[Joneslab]

Does anyone else ever get the feeling that Cal would never bench a "prospect" for fear of losing a recruit yet to be? I have had this feeling several times throughout his career. I know personally, I would not let someone continually make bad choices and leave them in. Some turnovers, missed shots, or other mistakes are acceptable. Not passing over and over. Cant let that go on.

The problem is that the players he brings in off the bench make very similar decisions to the others. There's a lot of sameness on this team: same level of talent for the most part, same mistakes, same youth.

If he could plug in somebody on the bench and get immediate results then that would be one thing. But usually he'll go to the bench and not much changes.

A lot of that is just a lack of elite talent. But Cal hasn't been able to coach them up in any way either. Seems to have a really hard time getting to a few of these players. Most of them, actually.

[BobS]

Talked Terrence Jones into coming back. I think he talked Patrick Patterson into coming back in some ways.

The idea that he pushes them out makes no sense with players like are on this team. I have to believe that doesn't happen with kids who are borderline--and all these players are. The reason we can say that with some confidence is that if you look at Cal's freshmen, those who have left have all been on draft boards. We haven't had Nick Richards type decisions made by freshmen. Even Orton and Archie Goodwin were projected near the first round. You don't have players just making wild leaps. That's not how it has worked in the past.

I doubt if he'll be super aggressive; if a kid wants to leave the program, then that means his family wants him to leave. That's too much for a coach to push against.

But Cal wants to win college basketball games. In the past he's used recruiting to do that, but now the recruiting has run out. Everything has changed. Everything. I don't believe he'll sabotage himself or the program by allowing players to make cataclysmically weird decisions like Nick Richards of all people trying to play professional basketball.

I think fans assume players like this are just like DeMarcus Cousins and are handled the same way. That's just not happening.

Jones came back because of the lockout. Cal may have advised him to return, but I seriously doubt he comes back with no lockout. Best thing to happen for us.

I don't believe Cal will talk any first rounder to return. Guys like Richards may be different. But he is already older than his class so that might be part of his decision. Diallo is just going to go regardless, imo. But Knox and SGA are on more than one mock draft in the first round. If that stays that way, can't see them coming back.

If I'm wrong, color me thrilled. I won't let myself get excited about kids like Knox and SGA returning. The thought of that makes me dizzy.

[Joneslab]

If I'm wrong, color me thrilled. I won't let myself get excited about kids like Knox and SGA returning. The thought of that makes me dizzy.

Well, no. That's not what the discussion about is above.

Everybody can see that Knox and SGA are possibilities because everybody can Google. The other guys don't have any discernible shot unless they want to transfer.

If most of these players don't return we won't be able to field a team. Cal might just leave Kentucky and allow the program to fend for itself, but I doubt he does that with Brad still around. So to even get the numbers you need to put a practice together you can't have a mass exodus.

The "weaker" Kentucky teams haven't had a mass exodus. 2014 had two freshmen jump. This team is below that in its talent level. Everybody can see that. These guys from the coaches to the families know the deal.

[BobS]

What do you call mass exodus? Fielding a team?

I think 4 will leave. We bring in 3 and get Baker back. Sounds like a wash to me. Now if we lose 5-6.......

[Joneslab]

And Cal gave a couple of interviews about Terrence Jones where he questioned Jones' maturity after his freshmen year.

The lockout was part of it, but we had a couple of other guys risk it even with that lockout. Jones was projected right around the lottery.

I think there was more to that than we know.

We tend to see them all as if they're superstars in the making. Most of these guys aren't superstars at all. There is no clear NBA potential in hardly any of these guys. They're not being written about by NBA guys, they're not spoken of, they're off the radar. That's why we're fielding a mediocre team.

But I think three or four of them have big-time potential as college players. Cal has spoken a ton this year about players staying. That's not an accident. He obviously sees what everybody else sees.

[Joneslab]

What do you call mass exodus? Fielding a team?

I think 4 will leave. We bring in 3 and get Baker back. Sounds like a wash to me. Now if we lose 5-6.......

I'm just speaking generally about the paranoia some fans have that we're going to lose everybody. And last year we did lose everybody, but graduation and transfer hurt us as badly as the NBA.

You'll always have three or four fans who seem to believe that they're all going to go to the NBA somehow. I'm speaking to that phenomenon.

Regarding four guys leaving...not sure who the fourth would be. I don't even think Diallo has a shot. He's totally off the radar at this point. He may pull a Briscoe, that wouldn't surprise me, but he shouldn't.

As for the fourth...Vanderbilt? Maybe, but again there is absolutely no heat around him that I've seen. Again, just looking at how it normally goes at UK the "I'm going even if I'm not anywhere near the first round" thing doesn't happen with our freshmen. Just no precedent for that. If the freshmen leave then we've seen them in the mock drafts.