The Good, The Bad, The Ugly: Louisville Edition

[J.Jennings]

I love it. Love that he’s still fond of the program and is welcomed back.

I just wish some of these players would stick around. The other night i was watching a replay of 2012 Kentucky vs South Carolina with Davis Jones Lamb and Wiltjer. What a great team and still sucks Kyle was not able to finish up at Kentucky, that kid actually played the 2 spot for us with Lamb at point with Miller Davis and MKG...


We have to find a way to get these kids to stay longer. What if Nick came back next year, think it would give us that boost to put us over the top?

[Joneslab]

We have to find a way to get these kids to stay longer. What if Nick came back next year, think it would give us that boost to put us over the top?

Hard to imagine he'll stay.

Richards will definitely get drafted. Probably in the second round, but he will be drafted.

Don't think he'll pass up the opportunity to try and make a team. Were he anywhere else in the country besides at Kentucky, he'd probably stay. Here, the chances of him returning for his senior year are relatively nil.

[Dwight Schrute]

JWorld's braoder point is correct, though.

[J.Jennings]

Hard to imagine he'll stay.

Richards will definitely get drafted. Probably in the second round, but he will be drafted.

Don't think he'll pass up the opportunity to try and make a team. Were he anywhere else in the country besides at Kentucky, he'd probably stay. Here, the chances of him returning for his senior year are relatively nil.

Unfortunately if you are not NBA ready in Cal's system in two years, you are a failure and written off. WCS and Richards may be the exception to the rule but Cal would rather recruit over you and gamble on a freshman...


Speaking of all that, i have been hard on Cal off and on the past few years but most of the time he finds a way, i just have to remind myself to be patient and give it time. I guess my biggest problem is i always have this fantasy of Kentucky basketball just rolling through everyone each and every game from the start and that's just not how these young teams are built...

[Joneslab]

I guess my biggest problem is i always have this fantasy of Kentucky basketball just rolling through everyone each and every game from the start and that's just not how these young teams are built...

But I'm not sure that's how hardly any UK team has been.

In my lifetime the teams that just rolled through everybody are probably two: 1996 and 2015.

Everybody else has had to fight, some more than others. We've had really good teams here who've looked really rough winning games and then turned it on late in the season. How many of us gave up on 1998? I know I did. They looked totally pedestrian until March and that team was full of vets.

(Note that I'm in no way saying this current team is anything like 1998. I just think when you have the bar set at UK rolling through the other team every night, that doesn't match with what actually happens on the court.)

[Dwight Schrute]

^^
2003 is a better example, IMO. That team looked pedestrian until that game at Vanderbilt where they just came out in the second half and dominated and ran off a string after that. If this team bought into defense like that, they could do something similar.

[Joneslab]

^^
2003 is a better example, IMO. That team looked pedestrian until that game at Vanderbilt where they just came out in the second half and dominated and ran off a string after that. If this team bought into defense like that, they could do something similar.

Yep.

Think that 2003 team had a much higher ceiling, unfortunately. This team has no Keith Bogans. Heck, this team probably doesn't have a Marquis Estill.

But you're right. These guys aren't devoid of talent or anything and defense has to be their calling card. But the simple fact Whitney can't play and Montgomery looks virtually unchanged from last year are major problems for us and make it so that we basically have to be vicious defensively to make any noise at all in March...

...or to even get to March. I'm still not sure this team is a surefire lock to get into the tournament because I worry we'll stumble a few times in SEC play. Saturday gave me some hope however.

[Dwight Schrute]

Yep.

Think that 2003 team had a much higher ceiling, unfortunately. This team has no Keith Bogans. Heck, this team probably doesn't have a Marquis Estill.

But you're right. These guys aren't devoid of talent or anything and defense has to be their calling card. But the simple fact Whitney can't play and Montgomery looks virtually unchanged from last year are major problems for us and make it so that we basically have to be vicious defensively to make any noise at all in March...

...or to even get to March. I'm still not sure this team is a surefire lock to get into the tournament because I worry we'll stumble a few times in SEC play. Saturday gave me some hope however.

Agree that someone needs to step up and score, but this team has a lot of pieces. Montgomery's not great but Richards has been solid. It's not the most talented team Calipari has had, but it ain't 2013.

I'm sure this team will take some knocks in the SEC, but ultimately Louisville's better than anyone else on the schedule. Florida, Arkansas, and Auburn are it in the SEC as far as good teams go. It's not out of the realm that the Cats post a gaudy SEC record and get a high seed in the NCAA tournament.

[Catatonic]

Speaking of all that, i have been hard on Cal off and on the past few years but most of the time he finds a way, i just have to remind myself to be patient and give it time. I guess my biggest problem is i always have this fantasy of Kentucky basketball just rolling through everyone each and every game from the start and that's just not how these young teams are built...

I totally understand the flaws and frustration, but as a general rule I try not to criticize Cal and will defend him in most cases. It's sort of like someone makes you a nice sundae with sprinkles and syrup and cool whip, you're probably not gonna say "what, no cherry on top??" We've had it pretty good as fans.

During the UK-UofL game my sister and I were pulling up old box scores of Cal's past teams here. Obviously Wall/Bledsoe/Cousins, The Platoon team, just ridiculous all those names in one place. Would have loved another championship or two, and on paper it looks like they shoulda, but then "that's why they play the game".

[Joneslab]

If Pitino was an A then Cal has to be an A-.

Of course it could go either way now. We seem to be at a kind of crossroads. If this team finishes like I think it will, which is pretty mediocre and in the 8/9 seed territory, then you're going to have a lot of fans getting bored with Cal's system (assuming UK doesn't make an NCAA run like they did in 2014). It's already happening now.

Kentucky fans are definitely picky but just because a person is picky it doesn't mean they're wrong. The flaws are pretty obvious with the whole one-and-done model. People are rightly asking whether a more traditional system would work just as well, PLUS have the added benefit of getting to know the players.

So much is going to hinge on next season, IMO.

[KCKUKFan]

If Pitino was an A then Cal has to be an A-.

Pitino and Cal can both be As.

[Catatonic]

Last edited by Lighthouse

Lol. Thanks for editing a word that literally is good enough for a G rated movie but not here.

[Catatonic]

Pitino and Cal can both be As.

Cal is definitely an A. Pitino has retroactively downgraded himself for me.

[Blue Heaven]

When you look at Cals record and accomplishments since he has been here, it's extremely hard to find many flaws on paper. We usually always turn it around and play our best ball come tourney time. It's the maturation process that just wears on me. Inexcusable losses and play have given me more gray hairs than I would want for my age.

[Joneslab]

I think Cal probably is an A in a lot of ways, notably in the excitement he brought to the program coming out of the Gillispie hellscape.

But the problem is that it's high risk/high reward. When things go bad it gets really sour for many fans because of the way we bleed players. We can be an okay team (think the Knox year, for instance) but it feels like a down year because you know we're going to lose most of the players. So it's like an A with an asterisk. You almost can't compare Cal to anybody in the past because he runs the program so differently. It's definitely true that the mystique of the Pitino years is very different, so that's why I would probably put it at an A- right now.

Were 2015 to go through undefeated Cal would be an A+ obviously. But ironically he'd still catch grief from fans because fans have no memories. I can't tell you how many times I've personally seen (on here and elsewhere) and heard people say that Cal doesn't have titles and goes out in the Sweet Sixteen every year.