How Do We Combat Duke?

[Joneslab]

So success doesn't breed success??

Just don't think players use national championships to make their decision. Much more seems to go into it.

North Carolina hadn't had hardly any recent success when that last group of players signed on. They had Roy Williams' worst teams at North Carolina when they landed those guys.

Think relationships with the staff, the comfort players feel in the program, who else they're going to play alongside, etc. has much more to do with it. UConn won two recent national titles and then promptly fell apart. Just don't believe players pay much attention.

[Lighthouse]

I agree that the kids who come to Kentucky, have very little interest to the name on the front of their jerseys, but don't you think that's the same with the one-and-done's that sign with other schools?

[catfaninin]

I don't think anybody can win it without stars unless they get really lucky.

I can't think of a national championship team that didn't have stars--or at least All-American types. You have to have them. Could anybody look at Justin Jackson last year and say he wasn't the best player on the court most of the time? Kris Hart the year before. Okafor and Winslow before that. Russ Smith and Gorgui Dieng before that.

These are all very good to great college basketball players. Whether Cal is the coach or somebody else, Kentucky has to get those caliber of players.

If he can't get them right out of high school though you have to hold on to the players who have star ability. That's the trickier thing more than development, because as soon as guys show any semblance of NBA-type skill they leave Kentucky.

You rolling Josh Hart and Kris Jenkins into one body? That would be quite the player.

[Joneslab]

You rolling Josh Hart and Kris Jenkins into one body? That would be quite the player.

Hart was the one I wanted.

Jenkins was a funny player. Not a star...but he was for that tournament run.

[BobS]

I don't think anybody can win it without stars unless they get really lucky.

I can't think of a national championship team that didn't have stars--or at least All-American types. You have to have them. Could anybody look at Justin Jackson last year and say he wasn't the best player on the court most of the time? Kris Hart the year before. Okafor and Winslow before that. Russ Smith and Gorgui Dieng before that.

These are all very good to great college basketball players. Whether Cal is the coach or somebody else, Kentucky has to get those caliber of players.

If he can't get them right out of high school though you have to hold on to the players who have star ability. That's the trickier thing more than development, because as soon as guys show any semblance of NBA-type skill they leave Kentucky.

I agree. And I guess my point wasn't clear. I have doubts Cal can do what Jay Wright did. At least not here. The Ky Effect is entrenched. Cal needs a top 5 kid to make stuff happen, imo. And he's missing out on them now, for whatever reason. And in most years, there is a pretty significant gap between the top 5 and the next group.

But things are changing. We will see how he adjusts.

[J.Jennings]

I don't know the answer but maybe it's simple, Coach K retires before Coach Cal does.

[UK8STL11]

I don't know the answer but maybe it's simple, Coach K retires before Coach Cal does.

I don't think that's likely. I firmly believe Cal has two more years left at UK (after this season) and then will move on to something else.. K will be at Duke at least that long and I don;'t think there is any chance he leaves Duke to do anything other than retire.

[Lighthouse]

Answer this question. How did Duke combat us? They looked at what Cal was doing, got the right assistants and went to work.

[J.Jennings]

Answer this question. How did Duke combat us? They looked at what Cal was doing, got the right assistants and went to work.

I think this goes much deeper than the assistants but i do agree. Cal losing with that under 19 team and then telling kids Kentucky isn't for everyone just isn't working no more. The kids are probably saying "your right", let's go to Duke then....

[Joneslab]

I think this goes much deeper than the assistants but i do agree. Cal losing with that under 19 team and then telling kids Kentucky isn't for everyone just isn't working no more. The kids are probably saying "your right", let's go to Duke then....

Yeah, the "Kentucky isn't for everyone" line has run its course.

It's meant to express exclusivity. It's why we don't give out many offers, I think. The point being that if you receive one of the few offers from Kentucky, you're special.

Problem is you walk a tight line doing it that way. You fall into situations like we're in this year, where we missed out on our top target and had to patch together a couple of other guys. Then we turned around with next year's class and missed again on our top targets.

They're trying to remedy this by throwing a lot more offers out there for 2019, but damage has been done. The specialness that UK has went away when a lot of other schools started to adopt the one-and-done philosophy. Cal was slow to adjust and he got burnt.

[J.Jennings]

Yeah, the "Kentucky isn't for everyone" line has run its course.

It's meant to express exclusivity. It's why we don't give out many offers, I think. The point being that if you receive one of the few offers from Kentucky, you're special.

Problem is you walk a tight line doing it that way. You fall into situations like we're in this year, where we missed out on our top target and had to patch together a couple of other guys. Then we turned around with next year's class and missed again on our top targets.

They're trying to remedy this by throwing a lot more offers out there for 2019, but damage has been done. The specialness that UK has went away when a lot of other schools started to adopt the one-and-done philosophy. Cal was slow to adjust and he got burnt.

Cal has to reboot on the recruiting trail if he chooses to keep coaching at Kentucky, the thrill is gone or so it seems..

[Joneslab]

You can win with these players but they have to be grown up by at least a year or more.

Then you have to come behind them with similar players.

This is how Villanova and other programs have done it. North Carolina too. By identifying players who are five-star (or high four-star) but who are not quite ready as freshmen and who will stick in the program. Thus you keep them in school and start building behind them with identical types of players.

The task for Kentucky is that we can't keep even our flawed players in school. The NBA likes our guys because of the success of the better players who've come before them. It's much harder for us to keep guys because as soon as they show some potential the NBA jumps on them.

But the problem isn't these players, I'm convinced. Some of these players could be great college players. It's that these players just are not ready. Imagine tossing guys like Azubuike and Hayes and Fitch and even the Harrison twins out there as freshmen all on the same team. You would have what we have with this bunch. But let that caliber of player grow up and you've got something special.

[Lighthouse]

I won't be quick to judge Cal's coaching by this years players. He hasn't been very successful in getting this bunch to play as a team like he has other teams, but he's coaching them as hard as he can. I also believe he tells them a much different line than he tells us, but he is a good coach.

[J.Jennings]

If you land a few Superstars, it actually takes pressure off the other guys so they develop without the added pressure, basically they relax and play ball under the radar. Now we are in a siutaion that Cal recruits and tells them Kentuck "isn't for everyone" but if you work hard you can be the next 1st rounder picked and a milionaire in a year, alot of these kids have the pressure of living up to that expectation, it's hard if your not the next J. Wall, Cousins, Davis, etc.. It's almost seems that if you don't get drafted after year 1 at Kentucky, you are a failure, who wants to play like that?. Throw in the added the pressure and expectation of playing at Kentucky with our fanbase and in reality, Cal is right, Kentucky isn't for everyone, who needs all that pressure especially if you know you are a superstar and are headed to the NBA regardless of who you play for, why even deal with Kentucky????

[J.Jennings]

I won't be quick to judge Cal's coaching by this years players. He hasn't been very successful in getting this bunch to play as a team like he has other teams, but he's coaching them as hard as he can. I also believe he tells them a much different line than he tells us, but he is a good coach.

Im just prepared to chalk this season up as a loss and move one without getting into Cal coaching and recruiting methods. If this seems to carry on for the next few years, then yes it becomes a huge problem and the UK fanbase will completely unravel and he won't want to be in Lexington any longer, it's a fact....

I still believe this more than anything, Coach Cal hates losing more than we do it that's even possible.I think he's very passionate, he's fully invested in what he does,and losing is not in his DNA, it goes against everything he stands for.