Austin Peay giving former Kentucky DE Lloyd Tubman a second chance

[Matt Dillon]

Former Kentucky defensive end Lloyd Tubman is getting a second chance at major college football after a 2014 allegation of rape ended his time in Lexington.

Per a report from The Leaf Chronicle’s Autumn Allison, has found a home at FCS-level Austin Peay after spending a year-and-a-half at Trinity Valley Community College in Athens, Texas. A grand jury opted not to indict Tubman in 2015, citing a lack of evidence in the case.

Tubman’s background was highly scrutinized through a months-long process before first-year coach Will Healy and the school decided to take him in.

https://www.seccountry.com/kentucky/austin-peay-giving-former-kentucky-de-lloyd-tubman-a-second-chance

I thought some might be interesting in knowing what happened to Lloyd.

[Lighthouse]

I hope he has his life straightened out, and plays some awesome football.

[Matt Dillon]

I hope he has his life straightened out, and plays some awesome football.

I have a feeling Tubman is a playah.

[boomdaddy]

I saw the dorm video and I think the young man got hosed. Yes, he was and is a very talented player. The whole innocent until proven guilty concept didn't apply to him and his career at Kentucky.

[Blue Heaven]

I feel he got a raw deal but there is a reason he isn't here. I don't know what that reason is but I wish him all the best.

[boomdaddy]

I saw the dorm video and I think the young man got hosed. Yes, he was and is a very talented player. The whole innocent until proven guilty concept didn't apply to him and his career at Kentucky.

It could be worse. His could be like Mike Tyson and he could have been wrongly convicted and have to live the rest of his life with a felony over his head. I hope the young man gets a shot at the pros.

From what I read, there was some technicality or rule that kept him from being allowed back, even though the charges were dropped.

[Spiritof96]

I saw the dorm video and I think the young man got hosed. Yes, he was and is a very talented player. The whole innocent until proven guilty concept didn't apply to him and his career at Kentucky.

Unless that video was inside her dorm room I'm not sure it would show you anything relevant to his guilt or innocence.

The University of Kentucky Conduct Office carries out its own investigation and para judicial process independently of the criminal proceedings. Both proceedings have different standards of evidence and guilt. This is almost universally the case at Universities nation wide.

There is no evidence to suggest that he was anything other than innocent until proven guilty on the basis of the evidence in both proceedings. He wasn't indicted in one case, he was (apparently) found responsible for violating the code of conduct in the other.

Further, UK's requirement for "consent" requires a "clear and unambiguous yes". (as directed by the Department of Education) It is very plausible that he could not be indicted for "rape" and be guilty of sexual assault under UK's student code.

[boomdaddy]

Unless that video was inside her dorm room I'm not sure it would show you anything relevant to his guilt or innocence.

The University of Kentucky Conduct Office carries out its own investigation and para judicial process independently of the criminal proceedings. Both proceedings have different standards of evidence and guilt. This is almost universally the case at Universities nation wide.

There is no evidence to suggest that he was anything other than innocent until proven guilty on the basis of the evidence in both proceedings. He wasn't indicted in one case, he was (apparently) found responsible for violating the code of conduct in the other.

Further, UK's requirement for "consent" requires a "clear and unambiguous yes". (as directed by the Department of Education) It is very plausible that he could not be indicted for "rape" and be guilty of sexual assault under UK's student code.

If you know the back history that they were BF/GF and see the video, I seriously question the charges against the young man. The young man should not have been treated as a guilty party and definitely should have been able to keep his scholarship. Common sense and fairness goes out the window, especially when a person gets accused of something. There have been plenty of women who lie, slander, or kill because they were scorned or jealous. I have been lucky to not have run into any of them, but I know guys who have. Women can falsely report rape after consensual sex, just like they fabricate child molestation to get 100% child custody in a divorce. It is about inflicting as much pain on the ex. The woman in the video did not have the body language of a victim;

[Joneslab]

Common sense and fairness goes out the window, especially when a person gets accused of something.

I completely disagree, at least when it comes to accused athletes.

There is a no more protected group of individuals in America than athletes. Athletes generally get every chance in the world to beat the system. Happens at every age of competition, from youth sports on up.

Step into a high school sometime and see the stark differences between the way athletes get treated and your average student. I've posted this before, but my wife taught at a local high school and was once verbally destroyed by a star football player after school hours. The young man was given "anger management classes" and was on the field for the game that Friday.

We taught at Owensboro for a year. There was a young man who would go on to play football for UK who was notorious for being academically poor. Did that stop him? Not at all. He played in every game that I saw that season and was an absolute star.

All this said, I've no idea what happened with Lloyd Tubman. It is, I agree, a sad story.

But this idea that all these accused athletes are being mistreated is completely wrong. I'd urge you to step in to these schools where sports are played and take a look at how these players beat these things and the forces that are set up to help them become eligible to play ASAP.

[boomdaddy]

I do agree that star athletes get by with grades. There have been some great athletes that have missed out on college, because they didn't put forth the effort. but somehow they were making good enough grades to play for the high school.

[Joneslab]

I do agree that star athletes get by with grades.

It's way more than grades. It also has to do with behavior and things that "normal" students don't get away with.

Sometimes, absolutely, they're burned at the stake of public opinion. But for all those cases there will always be faceless, anonymous supporters who believe them without seeing any evidence. So all that balances out.

But there's massive incentive to get these guys on the field/court/wherever. It happens at every school, every locality, every district in this country.

This idea that they're somehow discriminated against and don't get a fair shake is absolutely the opposite of how these things go down.

There are going to be individual cases (Duke lacrosse, etc.) where a gross miscarriage of justice is happening. But I promise you these athletes don't need people in their corner decrying how unfairly they're treated.

[boomdaddy]

When I was in high school we had a black assistant principal who let the young black females get away with skipping class, taking 2 hour lunches, and whatever else they wanted to do, by smiling at him. I don't recall any of them playing any sports. Favoritism is not confined to athletes. High schools are rife with politics, just like a large company or a municipality. A kid who happens to be the son of the Mayor will not only get a warning, but a ride home if he is too drunk to drive, by his local policemen. A star player will get more rope to hang himself than a bench player. Bobby Knight is an example of coach that would get fired for being a jerk at UK, but revered at IU. It all depends on how connected you are. Had Tubman been a star player and not a redshirt freshman, I wonder if he would have been shoved out of the school. I, in no way, think that Mr. Tubman was given any breaks. He was crucified in the court of public opinion as a guilty man.

[Joneslab]

I, in no way, think that Mr. Tubman was given any breaks.

Of course you think so. You don't believe the charges.

I'm sure some out there do believe in the charges.

As I said, the two groups cancel out. Neither knows what went on.

The point that was made generally--and I've seen you make it before, and it's wrong every time--is that people unfairly jump these athletes when they're accused.

That isn't how it works in most cases. There's a reason athletes tend to screw up at alarming rates. Why you see programs who've had literally years of legal trouble running through them.

It's because there isn't enough accountability. We revere our athletes but sometimes we're not as tough on them as we should be, and some of them need the adults in their lives to be very tough.

[Joneslab]

I saw an HBO special once on Penn State.

Penn State had a series of incidents that began to happen late in Paterno's career that pre-dated the Sandusky thing.

Most of them were assaults. Some of them were brutal. And in most cases the athlete wasn't disciplined at all.

When Paterno was interviewed, he blamed the press for distorting the story.

A father of one of those assaulted kids demanded an answer to why the player who'd put his son in the hospital was playing, and Paterno made a comment along the lines that people need to grow up and be a man. The players continued to play. This went on for years in that program.

And then Sandusky. It didn't surprise me when all that hit, because I'd seen Paterno give those idiotic interviews.

That's an extreme case. But it's indicative of how these administrations protect these players at times. I think it's going on right now at programs around this conference.

[Matt Dillon]

I don't have any idea whether Lloyd is innocent or guilty, but I believe if a player isn't charged by the legal authorities that should be the end of it. Determined to be innocent by law, but guilty by some board or committee at UK. That just doesn't seem right to me.